SECRETARY OF DEFENSE Pete Hegseth is under increasing fire for a double-tap strike, first reported by The Intercept in early September, in which the U.S. military killed two survivors of the Trump administration’s initial boat strike in the Caribbean on September 2.
The Washington Post recently reported that Hegseth personally ordered the follow-up attack, giving a spoken order “to kill everybody.” Multiple military legal experts, lawmakers, and now confidential sources within the government who spoke with The Intercept say Hegseth’s actions could result in the entire chain of command being investigated for a war crime or outright murder.
“Those directly involved in the strike could be charged with murder under the UCMJ or federal law,” said Todd Huntley, a former Staff Judge Advocate who served as a legal adviser on Joint Special Operations task forces conducting drone strikes in Afghanistan and elsewhere, using shorthand for the Uniform Code of Military Justice. “This is about as clear of a case being patently illegal that subordinates would probably not be able to successfully use a following-orders defense.”
That would require the administration’s own people to bring those charges.
And I can already tell you the words you’re going to hear if this makes it to court. “Unlawful Combatant”, a designation we created so we could ignore the rules of war while fighting in Afghanistan and Iraq. Trump declared the Venezuelan drug cartels to be terrorists. Now they’re treating them like we treated the Taliban in Afghanistan.
These guys are literally just waiting for the next outrageous thing to push this one out of the news cycle.
And yeah, we’ve been doing airstrikes like this for 20 years.
Spoiler: they won’t.
Those asshats will manage to walk. The ICC should step in so they can only travel between the USA and fucking Russia.
Prince Joffrey
50/50 they pardon everyone or Trump uses this opportunity to forcefully retire more generals and get Hegseth out.
Does being convicted of a war crime or murder make you ineligible to be Secretary of Defense?
Exactly the same amount as being a 34 time convicted felon makes you ineligible to be president
“held liable” means some bad press in ‘radical left’ media at this point, right?
I could bite my finger off too. Doesn’t mean shit.
Uhm, it’s secretary of war
Could be, but won’t. At least, not under this regime.
Maybe its ethics. Maybe some folks in the chain of command have the fear of God in them. Maybe there’s just better pay in the private sector and now is as good a time as any to cash out. But I suspect stories like this are going to be increasingly common in the run up to the '26 election.
Future President Pete Buttigieg will have a cabinet full of people who drew the line at double-tapping a Venezuelan fisherman. And they’ll be spearheading our next Great Ethical War with… idk, Argentina or South Africa or something.
we can hope for some high-profile resignations and maybe an outspoken admiral or something. And remember, it’s only Trump’s DOJ until it isn’t anymore, and I think the statute of limitations on murder is more than 3 years…
Not a Trumper soadministration’s? Implied but doesn’t this fall under the same reasoning as all the indiscriminate drone bombing from the Bush and Obama administrations?
This is actually the example they use of an illegal order in the DOD manual.
Page 1117 18.3.2.1 https://www.documentcloud.org/documents/23892053-dod-law-of-war-manual-june-2015-updated-july-2023/
Holy moly, all that’s left to do is to add a picture of Hegseth and of the exploded boat to illustrate this paragraph. SMH.
This should be top of the thread everywhere this story is mentioned, forever.
Nooo, but trump and all his totally cool and not criminal bros said that the president cannot give an illegal order…
No no, he limits himself to “Clearly illegal” orders, normal illegal is beneath him.
Incredible
Today I learned the word tragicomical
Pardons all around -orange turd
Held liable by whom? The President who absolutely would say he agreed with it? The legislature that will talk a good game but fold before doing anything important? The courts who are owned by the parties? Or the police who want this to be SOP, and wouldn’t enforce any orders for arrest?
UCMJ is its own system enforced by the military with its own courts. Hegeseth will probably avoid any repercussions, but holding the chain of command responsible for state sponsored murder will send a clear message about obeying illegal orders.
And not doing so sends a different, no less clear, message…
I guess some of these people expect to still be around in a couple years when there is a new administration that might feel like it’s a good idea to prosecute people for crimes they committed for trump.
in a couple years when there is a new administration
IF they don’t decide that any resemblance of election integrity is a nuisance they can get rid of with impunity. It’s looking less and less likely.
deleted by creator
The murders weren’t committed in the U.S. so…
It was self defense. They wanted to charge me with a war crime for commiting a war crime, can you believe it?
Do they even know who my daddy is?
Meanwhile daddy will be happy to throw his ass under the bus to save himself.
I worked at Fort Lewis in the RCF (Regional Correctional Facility, aka prison) and we had an Army soldier who got 3 years for 1st degree murder because he mercy killed a combatant after they got covered in white phosphorous. Literally everyone was like “how the fuck do you only get 3 years for first degree murder?” and then when they read his court documents were like “what the fuck, you got screwed and obviously everyone knew it…” They legally determined that at the moment they were no longer fighting back they became non-combatants and to kill a non-combatant instead of rendering aid is murder. Since the judge and jury agreed that it did violate the law, but hoped that if they were ever in that combatant’s shoes, they would want someone to do to them what this soldier did, so yeah, guilty, but sentenced to the bare minimum allowed.
I know for 100% fact there is precedent already. But that is rules for thee, not for them, so I highly doubt we’ll see anything happen. I’m sure they’ll claim they need immunity because they were operating under special rules of engagement or some bullshit, and it will take years and lots of lawyers and in the end it’ll drag on until its forgotten about and gets quietly dismissed somewhere.
100% nothing will happen, or they will just get pardoned. USA is done. Kaput. All hail Nazi USA.
It’s fucking comical how many Americans seem to think that the collapse of their entire legal system is just a blip and there’s a “normal” to go back to
Fairly sure the pardons are already filled out and signed preemptively.
They don’t even waste time by having them individually singed. Just copy and paste!
Ooh ooh how bout an autopen!
with fascists, every accusation is an admission
with fascists, every accusation is an admission
Once again, A LITTLE LOUDER FOR THE DOLTS IN THE BACK OF THE ROOM.
When dealing with fascists and Republicans - they are the same but Republicans have less scruples and more money -
“EVERY ACCUSATION IS AN ADMISSION.”
no, the autopen is treasonous
Fits Trump to a T then
it’s only treason when Demonocrats do it
They couldn’t get the auto pen to look stay dumb so they just had rubber stamps made.
You can buy them from your local maga roadside tent for $200
You know that Germany still exists, though, right? Something will happen…
No other countries are coming to save you from yourselves.
So to be clear, you’re suggesting the reason for allied forces joining WW2 was to save Germany from itself?
I’m not disagreeing that Trump will pardon everyone involved, I’m not disagreeing that no other country cares if the US comes out the other end, I’m just saying, these regimes have a history of not sticking around long term. So I’m disagreeing with the statement that “nothing will happen”. Shit is happening and will continue to happen until their reign of terror is brought to an end, just like WW2.
The thing is that Germany was a land empire; to expand they had to piss off and/or invade their powerful neighbors. America can do whatever the heck it wants and as long as they don’t do something dumb like attack China they’ll be left mostly to their own devices. Hell, I’d bet good money that the EU won’t lift a finger if they annex Greenland. We’re looking at more of a Franco or Sukharto situation.
It’s not “their” reign of terror. They are a symptom.
This shit is the fault of all Americans. Those who voted for it, those who enable it, and those who are sitting on their asses either thinking this ends with a new administration or who are waiting for someone else to come put Nazis in the ground for them.
Blaming this on the Trump admin is like blaming a toddler for bringing a loaded handgun to school.
The adults in the room number in the hundreds of millions and you’re doing fuck all.
Your analogy can’t have it both ways. Either the allies saved Germany from itself, implying there was a good portion saved from the fascist portion, OR the Nazi party was the fault of all Germans, those who voted for it, those who enable it, etc., and blaming any portion on Nazis/Hitler is like blaming a toddler. So which is it?
I’m 86% convinced you’re a divisiveness bot at this point. Prove me wrong.
Germany was saved from itself as an undeserved RESULT of the allies’ victory. The allies didn’t go in to improve the lives of Nazi enabling German citizens, clearly.
Even before the USA was kaput, double tapping became typical US strategy under the Obama administration, which makes me even more confident that nobody will face any consequences for this. To try Trump they’d have to try Obama.
To try Trump they’d have to try Obama.
Ok, and?
I really don’t understand why people (GOPers mainly, it seems) trot this line out every time there’s the “threat” of a Repub being (gasp) held accountable for something…
We don’t fucking CARE! GOOD! Prosecute the criminals! It doesn’t matter what side they’re on politically!
Some of us don’t hang our hat on individual cults of personality and just want the rules applied equally all the way across. Why is this so difficult to understand?
For some people, their entire world view revolves around “there must be in-groups to protect and out-groups to bind”. That’s it. Everything else is a polite fiction on top of that.
These people are, generally, bad people. Like, a child reading about them in a book would point out that they’re not good.
Many conservatives adhere to this world view.
We don’t fucking CARE! GOOD! Prosecute the criminals! It doesn’t matter what side they’re on politically!
You don’t care, but the people in power do. That’s the point I was making.
And……. Nothing will happen. As both commentators said and are, depressingly, probably correct.
That’s not how the US establishment rolls. Both sides will protect their man and that will be it.
Yes, bOtH SiDeS BaD!!1
Yes, both sides are in fact bad but that’s not really the point I’m making here. Please work on your reading comprehension.
“reading comprehension” is the standard excuse for those whose MOs have accurately been assessed.
Ah, yes, everyone knows reading comprehension is actually Russian propaganda.
If not bad, why let war crimes go unpunished?
Yankistani dumbass.
Thanks for letting us know this extremely valuable feedback. Democrat bad. I am now converted.
I’ve seen this sentiment a lot lately. It’s just a very bad argument.
We aren’t going to type out a list of every US war criminal ever. We are talking about current events and want the active war criminals stopped.
Obviously we should try all war criminals, but let’s stop the war crimes first
That’s not my point. If Democrats seriously attack Trump on this, he’ll hit back by attacking them for supporting Obama, and establishment Democrats won’t throw their man under the bus. Ergo, nothing will happen. Screw Obama, but that’s not the argument I’m making here.
Edit: Aaand there it is.
