Yes, and the people doing mental gymnastics to defend it are unprincipled losers and/or cucks to the billionaires.
The models used to generate code were built by stealing from us. Fuck whatever stupid opinions you might have on copyright; you were exploited. Elon Musk, Mark Zuckerberg, Jeff Bezos, Sam Altman, etc are making money, corrupting our democracy, and destroying our way of life because they stole our work. They wouldn’t be able to do that without the massive theft of labor they’ve committed, or if our government actually enforced the laws that they broke, and are currently still breaking.
Why should these scumbags (or anyone) be able to steal and profit from our labor? Are we going to accept our assigned roles as mere cattle for the megacriminals? Will you be happy when your daughter is conscripted as a “breeder” for Elon Musk? Or when your son dies fighting in a war for resources so we can build more data centers?
Or how about when the subsidized tokens run out, you can’t afford to use the models you’ve become unable to function without, and are forced to go work in an Amazon warehouse or copper mine or some shit because you eagerly and enthusiastically contributed to the monopolization of your own labor, and were too stupid to realize it before it was too late?
I don’t like using the word “theft” because it implies this is primarily a property rights issue, and IMO it’s much more of a labor rights and moral rights issue. This ain’t gonna be solved by just enforcing existing copyright laws when employers, publishers, social media companies, etc. can effectively force creators to waive their rights as copyright holders. (Sign away your rights to AI training or you won’t get a record deal! Sign away your rights to AI training or you won’t get any work at all!) I tend to think we should focus on bringing back sectoral bargaining (like what the Hollywood writers and actors did) and/or creating new laws that recognize inalienable moral rights for creators.
My subjective opinion is that yeah it is unethical, but not more then so many other things we normalised.
Systematicly slaughtering animals for meat for example.
I am not a vegitarian by any means. You cannot fight on all fronts at once and have to pick your own battles in context of your own lifes challenges.
Cars poison the air and kill many people, i dont drive a car for that reason because thats a fight i can fight. I have sensativities with food, so i am not cutting out meat. (I aim to do so some day)
I moved to linux some years ago by getting help from an llm which requires datacenters build by malicious companies. I don’t have a google or meta account and my cloud and media is hosted locally on recycled hardware. Where for others those services require datacenters build by malicious companies.
I understand the theft argument and I don’t really endorse AI code but I will say one thing and this is genuine question. Isn’t coding predominantly theft? You can figure out how to do something you look on Stick exchange and copy what you find solve problem, done.
Maybe in some perspective but could not be further from mine.
All non personal Informations should be free.
Code is just information, who is one person to tell me i cannot arrange letters and words in a certain order because they did it first.
In context, i was already firmly opposed to the concept of copyright long before llms became consumer accesible. Imitation is the greatest honor someone csn receive.
I often get a question about “means to live”when i mention that. In short i think all people deserve the means to live comfortably regardless of economic output or labor.
I dont propose to change the current system overnight though, i would need to write a couple of books to fully explain the gradual transformation to the zero profit society i envision.
I think you’ve derived the wrong point from my stance.
Theft. In my eyes. Is on a sort of sliding scale with regard to ethics.
Stealing from an individual is reprehensible. Stealing from a corporation that nets more than one billion dollars annually? You have a moral imperative to take whatever you can get from them.
I day “Steal” more affectionately with respect to coding. Context matters deeply. Data should be free dah. And the socialism. Good.
but isn’t using AI inherently unethical?
Yes, and the people doing mental gymnastics to defend it are unprincipled losers and/or cucks to the billionaires.
The models used to generate code were built by stealing from us. Fuck whatever stupid opinions you might have on copyright; you were exploited. Elon Musk, Mark Zuckerberg, Jeff Bezos, Sam Altman, etc are making money, corrupting our democracy, and destroying our way of life because they stole our work. They wouldn’t be able to do that without the massive theft of labor they’ve committed, or if our government actually enforced the laws that they broke, and are currently still breaking.
Why should these scumbags (or anyone) be able to steal and profit from our labor? Are we going to accept our assigned roles as mere cattle for the megacriminals? Will you be happy when your daughter is conscripted as a “breeder” for Elon Musk? Or when your son dies fighting in a war for resources so we can build more data centers?
Or how about when the subsidized tokens run out, you can’t afford to use the models you’ve become unable to function without, and are forced to go work in an Amazon warehouse or copper mine or some shit because you eagerly and enthusiastically contributed to the monopolization of your own labor, and were too stupid to realize it before it was too late?
I don’t like using the word “theft” because it implies this is primarily a property rights issue, and IMO it’s much more of a labor rights and moral rights issue. This ain’t gonna be solved by just enforcing existing copyright laws when employers, publishers, social media companies, etc. can effectively force creators to waive their rights as copyright holders. (Sign away your rights to AI training or you won’t get a record deal! Sign away your rights to AI training or you won’t get any work at all!) I tend to think we should focus on bringing back sectoral bargaining (like what the Hollywood writers and actors did) and/or creating new laws that recognize inalienable moral rights for creators.
But otherwise, yes. I very much agree.
My subjective opinion is that yeah it is unethical, but not more then so many other things we normalised.
Systematicly slaughtering animals for meat for example.
I am not a vegitarian by any means. You cannot fight on all fronts at once and have to pick your own battles in context of your own lifes challenges.
Cars poison the air and kill many people, i dont drive a car for that reason because thats a fight i can fight. I have sensativities with food, so i am not cutting out meat. (I aim to do so some day)
I moved to linux some years ago by getting help from an llm which requires datacenters build by malicious companies. I don’t have a google or meta account and my cloud and media is hosted locally on recycled hardware. Where for others those services require datacenters build by malicious companies.
Life is various shades of grey.
I understand the theft argument and I don’t really endorse AI code but I will say one thing and this is genuine question. Isn’t coding predominantly theft? You can figure out how to do something you look on Stick exchange and copy what you find solve problem, done.
Maybe in some perspective but could not be further from mine.
All non personal Informations should be free.
Code is just information, who is one person to tell me i cannot arrange letters and words in a certain order because they did it first.
In context, i was already firmly opposed to the concept of copyright long before llms became consumer accesible. Imitation is the greatest honor someone csn receive.
I often get a question about “means to live”when i mention that. In short i think all people deserve the means to live comfortably regardless of economic output or labor.
I dont propose to change the current system overnight though, i would need to write a couple of books to fully explain the gradual transformation to the zero profit society i envision.
I think you’ve derived the wrong point from my stance.
Theft. In my eyes. Is on a sort of sliding scale with regard to ethics.
Stealing from an individual is reprehensible. Stealing from a corporation that nets more than one billion dollars annually? You have a moral imperative to take whatever you can get from them.
I day “Steal” more affectionately with respect to coding. Context matters deeply. Data should be free dah. And the socialism. Good.
Oh sure, thats a miscommunication error then.
I wouldnt call it stealing myself but i can find myself in your definition.