Your friend can be honored by all who read and think about this comment. She was a light in the darkness, and a soft touch, when all you knew was pain. She left a mark on you, so honor her by making a mark on others. My guess is that you already have and are…

That is what I mean. The “white moderates” that MLK wrote about. Folks who agree with a movement’s goals, but ultimately fail it out of their own selfish reasons for keeping the status quo.

It’s rhetorical, because it’s kind of delusional to think one or few can have the talent and resources needed for the situation. It’s disheartening, because we need direction, but any leaders that rise will be immediately oppressed. Without direction, many may react in a manner that escalates the problem, putting further constraints on any resistance group we hope is lurking in the shadows.

There are millions of his base that are victims of bad associations. People who would be more decent, if it weren’t for the natural pressure to conform to social groups for belonging. Most of these people don’t go to church to find the “truth” of the universe, but rather to socialize. They want human connection like everyone. In many rural areas, there are no secrets, so others know if you’re not “clicking” with them. Now take this tight-knit group who shares many identity traits, and mix in propaganda that plays the field well. Now you have a captive group. Anyone within the group will be ostracized if they’re not in lockstep. We must understand the gravity of it. They lose their complete social world, and are left alone in the boonies. I’m not sure how the situation can be helped, other than stopping the flow of lies showered onto them. How, at this point? I don’t know.

Bernie Sanders was a figure to unite us at a pivotal point in our history. There are many rural reds who supported Bernie. We missed that opportunity. Too many “white moderate” types were too dense/selfish to recognize the moment. Instead, we went for the status quo, who eventually revealed herself as a genocide denier type. Next chance to go for change, we install the status quo again, and he was incompetent in dealing with reality. He couldn’t make out the writing on wall.

I haven’t observed, or maybe recognized, what you mean by us pulling down rising leaders; who and how?

We all may feel some impulse to act, even violently, but have a great feeling of uncertainty because there are no leaders. We need direction based off of game theory, or something. We need strategies that are surgical, because be real — we are outgunned. Yes, there are gun owners on the left, but come on, you know who has the lion’s share. Not only that, but we are different in that we hesitate to harm, because it’s the last thing we want. My dad kills animals for pleasure, but I do not. Also, if you aren’t armed now, you better do so immediately, because the gun nuts are not going to blink an eye when we are inevitably denied access.

We need real strategy. Daggers in a select few hearts may be enough to shift things.

Are there organizations or groups that do this? They would have to do it in secret, so how could we know? So it seems we’d have to assume we couldn’t know and form our own? Honestly, please clue me in!

We all may feel some impulse to act, even violently, but have a great feeling of uncertainty because there are no leaders. We need direction based off of game theory, or something. We need strategies that are surgical, because be real — we are outgunned. Yes, there are gun owners on the left, but come on, you know who has the lion’s share. Not only that, but we are different in that we hesitate to harm, because it’s the last thing we want. My dad kills animals for pleasure, but I do not. Also, if you aren’t armed now, you better do so immediately, because the gun nuts are not going to blink an eye when we are inevitably denied access.

We need real strategy. Daggers in a select few hearts may be enough to shift things.

Are there organizations or groups that do this? They would have to do it in secret, so how could we know? So it seems we’d have to assume we couldn’t know and form our own? Honestly, please clue me in!

We all may feel some impulse to act, even violently, but have a great feeling of uncertainty because there are no leaders. We need direction based off of game theory, or something. We need strategies that are surgical, because be real — we are outgunned. Yes, there are gun owners on the left, but come on, you know who has the lion’s share. Not only that, but we are different in that we hesitate to harm, because it’s the last thing we want. My dad kills animals for pleasure, but I do not. Also, if you aren’t armed now, you better do so immediately, because the gun nuts are not going to blink an eye when we are inevitably denied access.

We need real strategy. Daggers in a select few hearts may be enough to shift things.

Are there organizations or groups that do this? They would have to do it in secret, so how could we know? So it seems we’d have to assume we couldn’t know and form our own? Honestly, please clue me in!

If the money is corrupting all players and steering the agenda, why not go after it? When we strike directly at agents of force, then we are directly attacking family and friends of a multitude of others, including of folks that may be trying to reconcile things. It will rile up his base into murder frenzy. Many undecided (dummies) will get swept up in the frenzy, because they’ll defer thinking to others around them. The rabid base have few relationships with their oligarch masters.

Lobotomize their think tanks.

Cut out the tongues of their media propagandists.

Bring any and all levels of direct action against the class that is causing this.

You know what I mean: city, county, state

Fight back! But consider:

1. Why do they want direct violence with their thugs?
2. Direct violence with ICE leads to direct violence with police, MAGA civi-thugs and military.
3. Would MAGA base have the same violent and visceral reaction if violent events happened to wealthy folks whom they probably never heard of who live in disconnected realities from their own??? A thought tickles my mind that maybe they would not. Maybe it’s a pathway…

Agreed. We should commandeer it wherever we can for the immediate term, but we should ultimately leave the Democratic Party in the waste bin of history.

1. They don’t represent us.
2. They stood by while fascism took root, then welcomed them in with a smooth transition.
3. Their name in itself is poisoned. There are folks who would have a much easier time separating themselves from their crazy peers if they had realistic options other than Democrats. The name is literally connected to everything evil by way of propaganda.

Let Schumer and Jeffries know that they are cunts, and will always be remembered as Democratic Cunts, the party that bent over for fascism.

Yeah, I feel my hypocrisy. I am trying to understand more, but my mind always ends up melting. Individuals I’ve met that maybe could do what I want done are a different breed from me. I am pushing myself to understand more, but I am pushing uphill and it will take years before I can achieve what probably so many all around the world could do now. While I sharpen myself, I ask: who were those in the V masks of years past?

These behaviors will only get worse, unless we change the system. We just need to help each other understand that, and then execute it!

Where are the hactivists?! Are they all too well employed?

Remember that our alliance was born in the blood of our grandfathers. My grandfather died in old age from old shrapnel causing a bleed. He was shot diagonally by a machine gun with bullets hitting leg to shoulder and then grenaded. Other scout with him shot dead through the neck beside him.

Be warned! What is happening here is a pathogen. Those within will need each other.

I am still confused by your thoughts. I truly do not mean to entrap you somehow, if that’s what you mean. I am only trying to understand your beliefs and then refine mine. A cycle of asking refining questions and getting candid answers is how I try to understand someone’s beliefs. Also, some of the questions were answers to your assertions. I was hoping the questions would reveal that I am not referring to a mental process that constrained to any time or place. Not constrained to family.

Yes, the situation was different with the civil rights movement. I was referring to a very specific trait in human behavior that I am trying to fully understand. I can understand if white moderates looked down on blacks and decided that now is not the right time and such, but they didn’t necessarily look down on them. The changes would inevitably cause personal pain to those white moderates. Within them is the full spectrum, including ultra-wealthy who would prefer stability of their economic realm. My thoughts circle around to how a group can be strong and united for a worthy cause, but totally fail to do what is needed, because of individual selfishness. I don’t mean selfish in a bad sense, but in that we will all naturally consider our situation and how our situation will be affected. Consciously, or not, we will account for our own needs, desires and fears. I strongly believe that this an abstract thought process that we apply everywhere.

I just looked up about yes sets. Haha, I was so so confused why you writing of car sales. No, I was trying to establish a foundation of agreement. I hoped you would agree with caring for yourself and others in your life. I also assumed that your brain would process the implications, whether you’d like it to or not. Sometimes those questions seem to cause some sort of cognitive dissonance (something else I try to understand) and the person refuses to answer in a candid way, or has an emotional outburst. I experience it all the time in the US now. MAGA mind will argue in bad faith until they pass out. If one won’t answer questions that ground the conversation, they are likely a troll.

We can end it here, that’s fine.

Firstly, thank you for the discussion.

And my point is that you cant expect every culture act similary to 30’s/40’s white american nuclear family

I must be poorly making my point. I am writing about something all humans do in all times and future. No healthy animal decides to hurt itself. Parents instinctively protect and care for their children. Parents often try to safeguard their children’s futures by making them healthy, educated and financially secure. This has nothing to do with a nuclear family. If my friend takes medicine to live, I want them to always have that medicine available to them. If I have a pet, I want them fat and warm in the winter. I don’t want to die. I want to live. These are all things humans consider, or they are brain dead.

Please answer this question: Would you sacrifice yourself, and everyone you’ve loved, for your principles?

I expressed that in frustration and anger. I have only seen one video of protests where there was something getting lobbed at officers from behind the protesters. There were claims that it was done by boot lickers, but I have no proof, and I can’t find the video now in the sea of content.

My frustration is that it is illogical to think they (MAGA in general) are not accustomed to doing false flags. I know that isn’t what you said. I protested in WA during BLM. There is a mountain of evidence of MAGA driving in and causing trouble in those events. I watched them peel down the streets in their trucks as we marched. I lived around them. I know what they spoke of. There are Boogaloos in jail for false flags shooting at cops during BLM: https://scholarlycommons.law.hofstra.edu/faculty_scholarship/1540/

I haven’t observed that same extent this time. I think many of those thugs are now ICE thugs. Also, the stakes are higher for false flaggers against ICE. They don’t want hurt either.

I that is an important metric

perspective afro american male It was this reason he was able to see the underlying causes of the injustices so well.

I am not communicating this well then. The hesitancy of the moderates was, and still is like your statement: “when people have lots of money tied to something, they try to keep things steady.” That is why I assert this is a fundamental trait we all share as humans. If fixing the status quo upsets my life, then I will probably temper my will for those changes. How do you not have this behavior? What if the changes necessitate a generation of austerity; a forced collapse of the existing system? If you have children, why would you NOT consider how it will impact them? This is basic human stuff. For me personally, I will likely die early for this principle, but I struggle with these contentions in my mind. I haven’t lived a nice life and I don’t have much of anything to lose in the way of children, partners, or money. But I do take care of my elderly parents, and my remaining siblings are both fully disabled in different ways. I imagine the situation where I get killed or jailed at the sunset of my mother’s life. She has experienced much pain hers. She has lost children. Do I want to send her off with more pain? No, and it absolutely affects my decisions. There are animals that I care for. I can imagine the stress and pain that they will experience when abandoned. Most people have WAY MORE to lose than I do, and my few things restrict me.

The Soviet Union was a communist authoritarian nation. I never implied that the strongmen were the oligarchs. Fascism is a particular flavor of bad people putting themselves over others. In this flavor of assholery, capitalist oligarchs have always had a large roll. It is part of the definition of fascism. People seem to think fascism == authoritarianism, but they are not the same, for one is a subset of the other.

There’s a whole spectrum of wealth. There are a surprising amount of batshit-crazy ultra billionaires. They have the same weaknesses as everyone else. They succumb to their own collective propaganda. They are narcissistic sociopaths.

Scholars also noted that big business developed an increasingly close partnership with the Italian Fascist and German Nazi governments after they took power. Business leaders supported the government’s political and military goals. In exchange, the government pursued economic policies that maximized the profits of its business allies.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economics_of_fascism

In the US, we have been pulling our hair out trying to understand why so many us are believing stark lies that lead to ruin. We have about a dozen billionaires in cabinet positions. Our oligarch class wholeheartedly supports Trump. Yeah, some push back when their pot gets disturbed, then they give the admin money or power in exchange for a carve-out and contract.