No, that’s not quite the same thing, I fundamentally don’t think it should be Linux’s goal to be a good windows emulator. It’s fine if wine exists and people use wine for that, but I don’t think that should be a goal for the kernel, this starts pushing into that territory. Hardware support very much is the Kernel’s job and modules which benefit it should be there if it’s meaningful
Except this is a scheduler issue from my understanding.
You can make the argument to put everything into user space, but it’s a performance issue.
One of the growing huge applications of linux these days is gaming, which depends hugely on performance, and almost every gamer out there is likely using wine (generally, without even realising it).
It’s not a scheduler issue, it’s a windows apps do thread synchronization differently to linux apps. Additionally fsync in the vast majority of use cases works just fine, the article notes most performance comparisons are against vanilla wine synchronization, i.e. without fsync or even esync. Regardless I still don’t think the kernel should be emulating windows scheduling behavior.
It’s literally that simple… but yeah, it is sync, you are correct
We could debate the advantage and disadvantages of a lot of things in the main kernel. There’s so much stuff in there that only benefits certain limited applications, and we could make the argument for userspace for almost everything, including a lot of filesystem drivers
Like it or not, wine and gaming is probably the biggest avenue where Linux is winning on the desktop at the moment (especially thanks to steam). We shouldn’t ignore it
I’ve been using Linux for at least 20+ years now. And seen a lot of stuff come and go.
A lot of distros are shipping with ntsync anyway, and, it’s something that will definitely get maintained
I already don’t compile it in…I’m just stating my opinion. I don’t think that should be something in the kernel. I complain, but I also do something about it.
Yeah, I get both sides too, I also want Linux to be successful but I’m just disappointed this is what we’re resorting to. Although I guess as long as I don’t have to use it it’s probably for the greater good?
Also, I grew up trying games like Unreal tournament on Linux.
At the time, I thought wine was stupid and would never catch up.
However we’re at the point that a lot of games already run better on Linux than windows even via wine… There are even more opportunities here in the future
Why? Lots of people are using wine.
That’s like saying we shouldn’t be including modules for reverse engineered hardware that only benefits that company
@auzy1 @Scoopta My problem with wine is that it can not work for most programs.
Depends. For games it’s usage is fairly common these days. It’s transparent in steam
It’s not perfect for apps but it does a surprisingly good job
No, that’s not quite the same thing, I fundamentally don’t think it should be Linux’s goal to be a good windows emulator. It’s fine if wine exists and people use wine for that, but I don’t think that should be a goal for the kernel, this starts pushing into that territory. Hardware support very much is the Kernel’s job and modules which benefit it should be there if it’s meaningful
Except this is a scheduler issue from my understanding.
You can make the argument to put everything into user space, but it’s a performance issue.
One of the growing huge applications of linux these days is gaming, which depends hugely on performance, and almost every gamer out there is likely using wine (generally, without even realising it).
It’s not a scheduler issue, it’s a windows apps do thread synchronization differently to linux apps. Additionally fsync in the vast majority of use cases works just fine, the article notes most performance comparisons are against vanilla wine synchronization, i.e. without fsync or even esync. Regardless I still don’t think the kernel should be emulating windows scheduling behavior.
Don’t compile it in then…
It’s literally that simple… but yeah, it is sync, you are correct
We could debate the advantage and disadvantages of a lot of things in the main kernel. There’s so much stuff in there that only benefits certain limited applications, and we could make the argument for userspace for almost everything, including a lot of filesystem drivers
Like it or not, wine and gaming is probably the biggest avenue where Linux is winning on the desktop at the moment (especially thanks to steam). We shouldn’t ignore it
I’ve been using Linux for at least 20+ years now. And seen a lot of stuff come and go.
A lot of distros are shipping with ntsync anyway, and, it’s something that will definitely get maintained
I already don’t compile it in…I’m just stating my opinion. I don’t think that should be something in the kernel. I complain, but I also do something about it.
Yeah. That’s fair enough.
Both sides have merit. I get both angles tbh
Yeah, I get both sides too, I also want Linux to be successful but I’m just disappointed this is what we’re resorting to. Although I guess as long as I don’t have to use it it’s probably for the greater good?
Also, I grew up trying games like Unreal tournament on Linux.
At the time, I thought wine was stupid and would never catch up.
However we’re at the point that a lot of games already run better on Linux than windows even via wine… There are even more opportunities here in the future